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Invasion of Privacy - ESOUI
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08/03/20, 09:07 AM   #1
iaai0110
Join Date: Feb 2020
Posts: 5
Invasion of Privacy

I'm looking for the addon that searches another person's inventory and reports back to him what is there.
I think this is an invasion of privacy. What do you think? Are there legal issues as the person being invaded hasn't given any kind of permission? Are there legal issues regarding the site that supports and allows programs like this to be downloaded and used? Or is this something that can be done on the internet only without any kind of moral consequence?
BTW there is a bill before the US Congress that doesn't allow sites arbitrary powers regarding their users' posts that do not violate site restrictions and arbitrarily delete posts and threads and kick users off the site without any kind of defense by that person for his posts, especially disabled people and people from different cultures. What do you think?
Also, btw, I have proved my point regarding my previous thread regarding the addons that improperly collect and display DPS information and would like to submit this information if so allowed. And I am open to have a discussion with the powers that be, that run this site via personal email if that is allowed.
Regards,
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08/03/20, 09:53 AM   #2
Wheels
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The contents of a player's inventory is not available to other players via the API, and as such there are no addons that let you search another player's inventory.

Most likely you are referring to addons that monitor the loot picked up by other players in your group. This data is provided to all clients in the group via the API by ZOS. There aren't any privacy laws or anything that will stop this from happening. It's a video game.
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08/03/20, 10:06 AM   #3
Rhyono
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You will be safe from these invasions of privacy by not grouping with any other players.
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08/03/20, 10:08 AM   #4
Mormo
Join Date: Jul 2020
Posts: 1
I assume youíre not trying to be exposed for the amount of [Chubs] in your inventory and I totally get it. Imagine the humiliation!
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08/03/20, 02:40 PM   #5
Baertram
 
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Welcome back, don't forget the squirrels: They are everywhere!

I'm looking for the addon that searches another person's inventory and reports back to him what is there.
I think this is an invasion of privacy. What do you think? Are there legal issues as the person being invaded hasn't given any kind of permission? Are there legal issues regarding the site that supports and allows programs like this to be downloaded and used? Or is this something that can be done on the internet only without any kind of moral consequence?
This is not possible via addons so just don't think about it anymore.

Everyhting else possible, like group loot checking addons, where already mentioned in others answers here.
The game provides it, so one can use it. There is nothing wrong with it.
Even if there wouldn't be any addon officialy created for the mass one could create one, use the given API and use it personally for yourself.
If you want to change this ask ZOs to remove it please IN THE OFFICIAL FORUMS.
No addon here using this is violating the TOS and you accepted to play the game, with it's given API, so you accepted that this is possible as well.

I do not even see the problem. If one is writing to you about your loot just ignore it or friendly answer your opinion.
And remember: It's a game not the real life!


BTW there is a bill before the US Congress that doesn't allow sites arbitrary powers regarding their users' posts that do not violate site restrictions and arbitrarily delete posts and threads and kick users off the site without any kind of defense by that person for his posts, especially disabled people and people from different cultures. What do you think?

Your last thread, which you obviously refer to here, was about the players kicking you from groups because of your low DPS, if I remember correctly.

So I personaly think this depends on the reaction of the users writing comments in forums of video games:
If they persist on something and start a war over it without accepting the several answers with "facts", where themselves only provide "self created facts by eye and gusses, not using the given API functions", and having been told several times that this is nothing one can compare to anything in "this particular game", they shouldn't wonder that they get a relating treatment, or are ignored.
Especially if they were told several times and did not seem to accept it, repeating the same "self created facts" again and again and again...

regarding the addons that improperly collect and display DPS information
So would you please refrain from starting the same thread again IF YOU REFUSE using the provided game's API and collecting your numbers and stuff COMPARABLE to the other addon's, which use this data?

If the addons use the same API functions there even will be no need in calculating all again manually on your side? Just use the given API and calculate the values AS THE GAME TELLS YOU THEY ARE ACCEPTED BY THE GAME!
The addons do not lie, as they use GAME DATA, and your calculations just were "wrong" (wrong as you assumed something that the game did not do/provide, and you were not able to measure the network interfernces (ping/package loss) and other criteria the API provides).

Addons compare the SAME BASE and therefor speak the truth about your DPS (as the game recognizes what is hitting and what is not hitting; you cannot do this manually just via using your eyes or pen and paper!), if the addon devs do not add something like "if the username is xyz then always subtract 1000 dmg". And I never heard of such special addons just created to fool you

Don't get me wrong: No one said it's ok to kick players from groups because of DPS.
I don't like this but I'm able to ignore it and play with others. Simple solution.
But the data you collected to calculate your DPS was just incorrect and not the correct data the game uses internally (and thus addons use).
So whatever you will do or try, you either need to accept and adopt your gear (you were the tanky guy living longer but doing less DPS?), rotation and skills, or simply search other groups that will like your way of playing.

Writing about it in an addon forum will not help at all. Maybe re-start the fight in the official ESO forums instead...

I cannot speak for the official site owners here, but I pesonally would prefer you do not start the same thread again unless you have redone your calculations using the addons providng you your DPS and prooving with facts, details and re-usable information "ingame" that they collect their data wrong.
Maybe it's better to post this to the particular addon then instead of abusing a forum thread, as the addond ev will most likely be glad to see the wrong calculations information to fix it.

Last edited by Baertram : 08/03/20 at 02:54 PM.
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08/04/20, 02:33 AM   #6
iaai0110
Join Date: Feb 2020
Posts: 5
Since you brought up the DPS thing, I will respond to your comments:
First, I have the dummies and I've checked my DPS. It is the same as the numbers that you see on the screen and the same that goes into the logs that the Addon uses. The noob problem I had before was with Flurry saying that the hit was immediate and that the hits occur over .6 seconds and I used this information to calculate what my DPS would be if my next hit was immediate at the end of the .6 seconds but the second hit is not immediate and does not occur at the .6 second mark. Also, it calls Flurry and chain where it appears to be different to me than any other chain in the game where the key is held until the chain is finished. This does not appear to occur with Flurry.
The second problem is that now that I have more experience and with hundreds of dungeons played as a "Tank" is that most of the time I can hit non stop and I watch others in my team die or them being chased by adds where their sequencing of the front and back bars to build there DPS is broken and they must start again and sometimes their sequencing is off for many, many seconds.
The third problem is regarding the mobs where the "so-called" high DPSers from range kill the entire mob getting all the points for DPS before any of the others on the team get a chance to hit at all.
Regarding down time (between mobs, death or running away), it seems to me that the Addons don't appear to take this time into account at all. The dummy times out when there is no action and gives a DPS calculation. Maybe these addons also do the same and then create a new DPS calculation when the action starts up again adding this calc to the previous one ignore the down time: I do not know. I had a discussion with a veteran player who uses these addons extensively and is a computer scientist as I am but not with the amount of experience. And after I explained my thoughts, he agreed with me.
There are a lot of tools in the game that if used intelligently can give you good information that can be used to better your play, e.g. Master Trader gives you a range of actual trade values, which, if you understand what is going on, you will know that values increase and decrease drastically when there is a ZOS event or something else going on that dramatically increases the number of players (demand) playing the game or more advanced players who are getting drops or creating items of greater value (supply) -- yeah, I studied economics too. lol
It's just too bad that here as elsewhere, people attack the person who is seeking an answer legitimately because of disability and culture.
Regards,
i'M DONE HERE!
Also, I can not get on the official forums as it always says that I need an invite.
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08/04/20, 04:31 AM   #7
Baertram
 
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I did not bring this up. Your post was clearly about it and I just responded to "your question" what we think about it.
Or are you trying to deny this...

It's just too bad that here as elsewhere, people attack the person who is seeking an answer legitimately because of disability and culture.
To be clear: I did not attack you and I don't care if you got any disabilities or what culture you are up to?!
Please stop from using such "phrases" because you don't get your will... It sucks!
So stop hiding behind this phrase and finally accept the "real facts", or explain which facts in detail are wrong?
Give example numbers, proof you have tested it with ingame profiling of ESO and dummy targets.
Test the addons you think collect wrong data and proof it's wrong compared to the ESO ingame profiling data (enabled in the settings menu).
But don't just say "you all suck" just because you maybe don't understand our answers properly?
You are the one attacking US here, not we are attacking you!

It's the technical aspect of server data send and received that comes to the numbers here, you are arguing about.
So why the heck should it have to do with your personal disabilities or culture?
I just told you the technical facts you should at least try to understand and take into account.

Let me try to describe it again (again):
Addons can only take in account what the server tells them happened.
And this is what ALL players also can and should ONLY take in account.
Addons never can guess anything or will respect movement or whatever. It's all about the numbers the game's API function is telling them.
Incoming dmg, outgoing dmg, numbers over time.

It does not matter what you will try to collect as information with whatever tools.
Use the dmg test dummies and the build in tools (ESO profiler in the settings) of the game and collect this data, share it with others who did the same, and THEN you'll be able to compare it.
Just fighting a boss or normal enemy somewhere collecting the data by eye or pen and paper (onscreen numbers) will not be anything comparable to others.
So as we said you need to adopt your measurements, which you (last time) refused to do and thus everyone told you that you cnanot have reliable data by other ways.

The addons take the same values the game provides and just use them internally.
If the vaules are wrong the server data is wrong! You should say ZOs to fix it then.

If ppl rely on the addons and kick you: Their fault, definately.
If you think this is unfair: Yeah, I agree.
But it's not the addon's fault, it's the humans fault!
And if they decide to be that rude and play that way, you can only avoid them and play with others having more fun


@Forums
If they restricted it to invitation only it might be that the forum is too full meanwhile. Sorry, did not know this is active.

Last edited by Baertram : 08/04/20 at 04:48 AM.
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08/04/20, 07:48 AM   #8
Sordrak
 
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The ESO forum was always invite only as far as i remember (started somewhere near April 2014 and it was like that already). Some players did not get an invitation to the forums.

Go to their help page. It should be possible to get an ESO forum account without much effort.
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08/04/20, 09:45 AM   #9
Dolgubon
 
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Originally Posted by iaai0110 View Post
It's just too bad that here as elsewhere, people attack the person who is seeking an answer legitimately because of disability and culture.
Oh yes we've all seen that picture of yourself you posted where you're disabled and/or doctors notes of how disabled you are, and based on that we decided to attack you. Oh and we're definitely all from just one culture, and totally not from around the world, and have decided to attack you because you're from somewhere else.
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08/04/20, 01:29 PM   #10
iaai0110
Join Date: Feb 2020
Posts: 5
I've been to support and the help page. No invite.
Support has a stock answer related to the game or "your request has timed out."
Regards,
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08/04/20, 02:25 PM   #11
Marazota
Join Date: Sep 2015
Posts: 209
you need to submit a ticket to get invite
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08/05/20, 02:31 AM   #12
sirinsidiator
 
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@iaai0110 the reason you got banned last time is because your behaviour wasn't distinguishable from a forum troll and you got reported by many people for that. Whenever someone asked you to provide hard evidence of your claims, all you did is repeat "I read those numbers off the screen and feel like I am right" (simply put) and you are already doing the same again. You can check this hilarious example of what trolling looks like and hopefully realize the parallels to your own behaviour to avoid being mistaken for a troll again.

To answer your questions in this thread:
I'm looking for the addon that searches another person's inventory and reports back to him what is there.
There is no such addon. Other people cannot see what you currently have in your inventory unless they are evil hack3rs and got into ZOS' database server. As already mentioned the only thing that is possible is for other group members to see which items you receive while you are grouped with them, which is done by addons like GroupLootNotifier.

Code:
I think this is an invasion of privacy. What do you think?
It think you are mistaken on a fundamental level. Let me show you something:

Hope that clarifies the situation.

Are there legal issues as the person being invaded hasn't given any kind of permission?
No. You implicitly gave permission the moment you registered your ESO account and accepted the ToS.

Are there legal issues regarding the site that supports and allows programs like this to be downloaded and used?
Again, no. The site has it's own ToS, which you accept when you upload or download an addon and if there were a real issue, they do their best to remove said addon as promptly as possible.

Or is this something that can be done on the internet only without any kind of moral consequence?
There are real consequences when someone does cause real damage to someone. Hurting your feelings is not covered by that. If you are not ready to hear or experience something like that on the internet, you have to protect yourself from it by not using it. It's the same when you are driving a car. As long as there is no accident, there is nothing you can do about someone cutting off your way or similar things that may annoy or scare you. It's up to you to protect yourself in that case or avoid such situations altogether by stop driving a car and use other means of transportation instead.

BTW there is a bill before the US Congress that doesn't allow sites arbitrary powers regarding their users' posts that do not violate site restrictions and arbitrarily delete posts and threads and kick users off the site without any kind of defense by that person for his posts, especially disabled people and people from different cultures. What do you think?
That's nice and all, but how would anyone enforce this kind of thing? I feel that's at most lip-service and it also won't apply to 95%+ of the internet that are not based in the US. And again, you didn't get banned for no reason. You came off as a troll and got removed for trolling, which violates the site-rules.

Also, btw, I have proved my point regarding my previous thread regarding the addons that improperly collect and display DPS information and would like to submit this information if so allowed. And I am open to have a discussion with the powers that be, that run this site via personal email if that is allowed.
Regards,
You didn't prove anything. The only way to prove something is by providing objective evidence (e.g. raw data collected via ESOLogs) as people have asked of you several times with no response and let others confirm your claims for themselves.
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08/06/20, 10:27 PM   #13
Shadowfen
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There are addons that theoretically can read the inventories of multiple accounts - the caveat being that the separate accounts whose inventories are read are all run from THE SAME COMPUTER - i.e. the addon reads its saved variables from all of the locally run accounts that used it.

They will not/cannot report on stuff on separate computers.
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ESOUI » AddOns » AddOn Help/Support » Invasion of Privacy

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