Quantcast some addons wont work - Page 2 - ESOUI
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09/22/18, 08:32 PM   #21
ziggr
 
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The harder it gets to release add-ons, the fewer add-ons you'll get for free.

I've already abandoned all but one of my add-ons, and barely have the will to keep that one up to date.

If I had to get a cert from somebody, or update my add-on every time there's an API bump even if no code needed to change? I'd just stop publishing add-ons entirely. I have better ways to spend my gaming time than programming for free.

--Z

PS: And yes, I look forward to switching WritWorthy to the new library scheme just like Baertram. I suffered through a rash of library version incompatibilities about a year ago that wouldn't have happened if I had the new system back then.

Last edited by ziggr : 09/22/18 at 08:43 PM.
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09/23/18, 06:43 AM   #22
Baertram
 
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Originally Posted by zgwortz View Post
Hmmn... thinking about it further, the cert mechanism wouldn't even have to be ZOS generated (they'd need to accept a cert file as a substitute for the API Version, but that's all they'd need to do on their side...) Cert files could be generated by any addon developer with a simple program, or even automatically by ESOUI if enough users mark the addon as "Safe for API version XXX". That would allow easy support of older addons which still work. Just trying to think outside the box a bit.
You write about so much great ideas and possibilities but believe us, we are doing this since years now.
There are reasons why it does not work, just accept this. There could be several other ways but I'm not going to step in this direction. Libraries are not to be included into addons or you could even put the whole lib code into your addon.

There is a solution and if this solution is "enable a small checkbox", then do it please.

Or you won't go this easy way and will fix the addons locally to your needs using included libraries, and do it over and over again each time we need to update the addons. This way you'll be able to use them "the way you like them".
Maybe you'll get the point about the time consumed to update the addons each time this way...

We just want to have time "to play" as well. So please, would you simply accept it finally?
Or talk to and convince Zos to provide another way to "protect you from non working addons".
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09/24/18, 02:35 AM   #23
BS Artist
 
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As a simple user of add-ons, albeit with an interest regarding their inner workings, I'm all for the reworked mechanism that developers are using to package their work. Downloading the libraries separately does, in fact make it easier (for me, at least) to understand exactly where issues are coming up when add-ons don't seem to be working as they are intended.

Big thanks to all the devs who create these wonderful add-ons and make it available to the public. Just know that a large, large majority of users do appreciate your efforts, regardless of how quiet they all are about it.
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09/24/18, 08:46 AM   #24
wambo
Join Date: Mar 2017
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I understand those changes and I support everything that gives the addon authors more time, since they already spent time for others.

But I really hope all the "changing" will be done coordinated. Bc with every addon I use and which does this change, I have to update all my Addon Presets to enable the Libs :-/
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09/24/18, 07:09 PM   #25
zgwortz
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Originally Posted by Baertram View Post
You write about so much great ideas and possibilities but believe us, we are doing this since years now.
There are reasons why it does not work, just accept this. There could be several other ways but I'm not going to step in this direction. Libraries are not to be included into addons or you could even put the whole lib code into your addon.
While I have not been deploying addons to the public "since years", I've been writing them for two years, and have written addons for other games in the past, not to mention writing libraries, standards, and innumerable best practice documents. I've seen these kinds of arguments before, and whenever anyone says "just accept this", it usually means they've stopped thinking about solutions and are simply being stubborn for the sake of stubborness.

If there are reasons why a solution "doesn't work", *say* them - don't hand wave them away. Are you saying it's impossible to update the versions of the libraries? That was the simple solution I suggested first.

Originally Posted by Baertram View Post
There is a solution and if this solution is "enable a small checkbox", then do it please.
That's a solution for a small number of users. Please go ahead and put that in bold in top of your addon descriptions and see how many follow your instructions. You're basically bypassing ZOS API version mechanism entirely, so you should tell people that's your choice. Me, I won't do it, and I know plenty of others who won't do that either. I'm NOT requesting you change this, mind you - I'm simply saying you are limiting your target user base and probably relegating your addons to obscurity.

Originally Posted by Baertram View Post
Or you won't go this easy way and will fix the addons locally to your needs using included libraries, and do it over and over again each time we need to update the addons. This way you'll be able to use them "the way you like them".
Maybe you'll get the point about the time consumed to update the addons each time this way...
No, why would I do that? I'll simply seek out addons which work instead. Or write my own.

Originally Posted by Baertram View Post
We just want to have time "to play" as well. So please, would you simply accept it finally?
Or talk to and convince Zos to provide another way to "protect you from non working addons".
Honestly, I would much rather ZOS remove that checkbox entirely and force addons to not load unless they are up to date. There's a reason they have the API Version field in the addons, and your approach effectively says you know better than ZOS how to interact with their game. But hey, you go on doing things the wrong way -- maybe I'm wrong about how other people will react to it.
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09/26/18, 09:13 AM   #26
Baertram
 
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You know zgwortz, you are somehow right: I do not want to talk about this anymore and want to wipe your discussion simply away. As this is a game and not my job!
It's making me angry you won't simply accept the fact that there is currently no other way to improve this.
You were redirected by many ppl now to talk to ZOs and argue with them, find a better way, do your thing.
I won't stop you there. And I'd be glad if it will be less work then today and functionally for the standard user as well.
I always told you guys you are free to do it your way.
Kee pthe libs within your adons, I'm fine with it.
But libraries are not meant and build to be included in each single piece of code if it is not needed. So I have removed them from my addons to get some benefits (listed in different threads now).
Maybe not a good example but dou you think Microsoft copies the same library files to each piece of code again if they can also work from within System32 directory? This will be only done with files which are changed or "could be missing" on some system32 directories.
-> Maybe Minion will be updated one day to install dependent libs with the addons. Would be cool.

It is you decision to "Not eanble the checkbox" (and maybe the same for many other users who do not want to know what this checkbox does in the back and why it is disabled after a patch).
-> But I also know a very large base of users who want to see behind the scenes and understand what it does. And I also know a lot of players who understood that this way of "security" is not working and who simply enable the checkbox and use their brain to deactivate error message affected addons afterwards. I'm glad these guys are alive because THEY will make the difference with ZOs if they need to decide another way of addon checks (if this will ever happen..). not "your" user base which just disables it and complains about non working/enabled addons afterwards
It is your decision to "Not break ZOs stupid way of using a version check to tell the standard user that an addon is broken, which isn't at all".
It's your decision to "use this fail of a check" and "wrong try to secure users".

I've accepted your decisions.

But if you do not want to update ALL addon's ##APIVersion: for us each patch where it is not needed...
Maybe you will volunteer to update them all? Or the libraries? Would be cool, thanks.

I guess you need to write your own addons then like you have told us.

But perhaps just talk to ZOs and try to get a better working "protection against old addons" instead of
bringing your dislike against the way it is done now from other games, libraries, projects, documents and addons here to the forums?

Last edited by Baertram : 09/26/18 at 09:16 AM.
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ESOUI » AddOns » AddOn Help/Support » some addons wont work

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